The Introvert Who Brands Loud — Visibility Strategies for the Quietly Ambitious

Has anyone ever told you authentic leadership means just be yourself, but nobody actually showed you how to do that? Or what does it mean to bring your whole self to work, to build influence and still get taken seriously without performing somebody else’s idea of leadership? Welcome to The Introverted Leader. It’s a podcast helping introverted leaders embrace your underrated quiet strengths so you can get promoted and start earning what you deserve. I’m Greg Weingar. I have over 25 years of leadership experience and yes, I am an introvert. My guest today is Jakara Rivera. She is a 20 plus year veteran leader at Lockheed Martin. She’s a speaker, a coach, and she’s author of The Leadership Trifecta. She calls herself a corporatepreneur because she’s been doing it all at once, corporate career and entrepreneurship and public speaking. And she’s worked with a lot of leaders across many levels, introverts included, and helped them figure out ways to lead from who they actually are. This conversation really matters if you’ve ever wondered if your quieter nature is holding you back because Jakara is very clear on this question. She’s an extrovert and she sees your strengths very clearly. Jakara believes introverts can be leaders, but it has to be authentic to you. You can’t lead in the style of an extrovert. In this episode, you’ll learn one, what authentic leadership looks like in practice, including how do you identify your own personal brand and close that gap between how you’re showing up and the way you want to be seen. Number two, one specific powerful feedback question that Jakara has developed with her teams. She teaches it in her coaching and turns vague responses into sharp actionable feedback that you can start using and raise your game. And number three, how to raise visibility in virtual meetings without having to be the loudest voice in the room. This is a practical low friction move that you can put into practice now. Okay, let’s get into it. All right, welcome to the show, Jakara. Awesome, happy to be here. So I have to ask you this because I ask most of my guests, are you an introvert or an extrovert? If you ask anyone else, they’ll tell you I’m an extrovert. But yes, I will claim to be an extrovert, but I love my quiet time and be able to reset with myself as well. But mainly extrovert for sure. All right, extrovert in touch with her quiet side. There you go. You’ve had a really, really interesting career. You spent a lot of your time at Lockheed Martin. You’re doing the speaking and coaching now. Maybe walk us through that journey a little bit. And what led you to do what you do right now? So finance by trade went to college. You got a finance degree and Lockheed was actually my first job right out of college and just been working through different levels of leadership within that company for over 20 years now. And through that time, becoming a leader and a manager, you want to be sure that you’re leading your teams well. So I took it very seriously. Let me understand human behavior. So I got some certifications and one of my superpowers is training and developing people and mentoring. So I did that at work. I did some trainings on the fact that the people development side soft skills, as well as the technical skills and our finance field. But I was so good at it because I’m like, I wish I could do this full time. And the message at the time was how to be a better version of yourself. And what I did was continue to work at Lockheed, but I also started to build my speaking business and would speak at smaller conferences and colleges. And that was really my heart. I wanted to be sure that people that went out into the world, they could be in touch with themselves and show up to work as their full selves, right? So with that, that time went on, I brought in coaching because, again, my heart is to build people and develop them to be that best version. So I’ve actually am now doing both. I’m still working my corporate career, as well as an entrepreneur and building the speaking business. So I call myself a corporatepreneur because I’m doing a little bit of everything. Yeah, I love that phrase, a better version of yourself because it really touches on that piece of authenticity. So as you’re developing a leader, what does authentic leadership look like? An authentic leader starts with yourself, right? Before I can build anyone else to be an authentic leader, I didn’t want to show up that way and model that. For me, that means being me, being the extrovert that I am. For others, it might being the introvert that they are. But really getting in touch with what my superpowers are. And as I mentioned, presenting and training, I love to be able to take complex ideas and share that with others. Others that may have their stronger interests might be more technical, but really understanding who you are at your core and how you want to show up at work. So personal branding is also important. When in the office space, I show up as I’m fun, lighthearted, but competent, as well as a leader. I want to be able to show up in a place that people can say, if I asked a car a question, she doesn’t know what I know that she’s going to go and find out. She’s going to lead the project, lead the people and get it done. So what is it about you that makes you you? When you’re in a room, when people, when you leave that room, what are the three words that people say about you? Do they say, oh, you know, she really knows what she’s doing? Or, you know, he always comes up with great ideas. Or he’s so quiet, I never hear from him. I’m really not sure if he knows how to do his job. What is it that people are saying about you? And if it’s not what you want them to say, how do you build that brand, that personal brand to show up that way? So being authentic first is understanding who you are. And then second, making sure that that reflects in what other people see. And that part is that’s where skill comes in, learning how to be able to balance both of those. You’ve worked with a lot of introverts and coach them as individuals and coach them as leaders. Have you had some of them come to you and say, I feel like I need to act like the extrovert, you know, help me turn me into an extrovert, Chikara? Yes, I have. And my quick answer is no, I need you to be you. You were hired because you have a skill set. You have a personality. You have something in you that we wanted to bring you in so that you could serve the community, serve the company in that way. So I think what we see is when we see others do well, it’s like, well, I’ve got to be like them so that I can do well as well. And I think that’s a fallacy, you know, I think, I’ll take that back maybe 20 years ago when I first started in corporate, it really was like that, right? Leadership would look for people that look like them, that sounded like them, that acted like them, they molded into their character. And if you weren’t that, then you were off to the side. I definitely see a change in the way that corporations are raising up their leaders and who they’re looking for. We’re looking for the diverse opinions. We’re looking for people who can bring differences to the table, because that helps us all be a better company, board, business community. So when anyone comes and says, oh, the way you let that meeting, you were so charismatic, and I’m not great, but that’s how I do it. How would you do it? And so again, my first step with anyone that I mentor or coach is let’s figure out your style. Again, what is it that makes you you and let’s bring that out? And then also understand what is the company value? Because the company values loud, audacious, and they ignore everyone else. Maybe that’s not the best company for you, right? But if your company is willing to accept the brilliance that you bring, then my first step again is let’s figure out where you are. And there’s, you know, like you have Myers-Briggs, and they have social files, and there’s all these assessments that you can do, just to kind of help you think through that process of how do I want to show up and what’s my natural inclination. So for those who might be more on the intuitive side, there is some skill that goes to how do I express that to other people who think differently than I do. So I really am a big believer in situational leadership. It’s where I know who I am, but I also have to know how I need to relate to you. Because I, even with my kids, right, I can talk to one and just raise my voice a little bit, and they’re like, oh, okay, mama mad. The other one ignores me completely, no matter what my tone is, right? So I have to learn how to communicate with different people. And that’s the second part of the skill set, know who you are. And then some of those practical tips would be interview, like I said, do those self-assessments, maybe some of those quizzes, those things that are out there. But you can interview other people, people that you respect and say, how do I show up, you know, in that meeting? Or when I walked out, what did people say? You want actionable feedback. You don’t want people to tell you, oh, it was great. Oh, you did wonderful. All that, you know, your presentation was good. You want people to say, ah, you came off a little flat. You came off that you didn’t care. It didn’t show, and maybe that wasn’t your intention. But now you know how you showed up. Now you know there’s a gap. How do we feel that? Those are the questions I like to field when I mentor and coach is because now we know where there’s a gap that we’ve got to feel, feel, and it just depends on what that is and how far we need to go. So it’s great to hear from your perspective, you’re seeing a shift in the culture. That’s very dear to my heart to try to influence. I do see it. I think it depends where you are. And that is a great point to look around and really get a honest feel. Is this a place that is more open? And just before we move on, what do you observe are those strengths of introverts that they can really bring to a leadership role? So when we think introverts, typically, you know, we have the stereotypical view, right? Quiet, not, maybe not as expressive as others or very analytical. So those are the types of things when you, I see that myself. I see that in my team. As a leader, I like to pull those things out. I want to say, okay, I see you thinking over there. What are you thinking? Right? And if someone is not reaching out to you and trying to help you pull those things out, you’ve got to be confident in the way that you communicate. I think that is a skill set when you’re thinking of, I want to be able to share something, but two people are overpowering the conversation. What do I do? How do you speak up in that manner? So learning how to either assist you, I like to add to the conversation. I do a lot of virtual meetings in my space. So even in the chat, I’d like to add to this if there’s ever a moment or when there’s a next moment, I’d like to share. Because in that, at least if those two people who are overpowering the meeting, there’s a note down there and seven other people are in the call, they can say, oh, well, Greg has something to say. Let’s make sure we pause for that. So I love when leaders help to pull those types of things out. But as an introvert, if you feel that, hey, this conversation is overpowering, you have to insert yourself. If you have something valuable to say, don’t just do it to do it. I know I’ve got that advice early on. Always say something in a meeting. I don’t necessarily agree with that advice unless it’s valuable. But again, you wouldn’t be in the room unless you didn’t have something valuable to share. So be sure that you first know that you have something of value to share and then insert yourself in the conversation. I think another great attribute is being, if you’re very analytical, you have a lot of detail. So you’re going to think differently than someone else who’s kind of just driving the conversation. You may have a different perspective because you thought through the details. You may have some additional research. The challenge might be, how do I summarize that so I can get it out quickly? Because detail person through a detail person, oh, y’all can talk all day. But if a detail person is talking to a bullet point person, there’s got to be some openness from the bullet point person to slow down and listen. But then how do I summarize what I need to say to get to those highlighted points? So communication is super important. And learning how to think and summarize the thinkly, what you need to say to share. I love that point. It’s absolutely true. When you are a detailed person, it might be harder than you think. There’s a definite skill in summarizing things. AI can help. It’s a great thing. But there’s an art even to that. I would love to hear from your perspective more about leading introverts as an extrovert. What do extroverts need to know as a leader, an extrovert leader? What do you need to know about your introverts and how to get the best out of them and best support them? Yeah. The best way that I found is one-on-one conversations are, I think, critical. What you’re not going to find an introvert in a meeting of 20 people is be the first one to talk and tell you about their whole life story. So I would tell you, don’t force it. So as a leader, again, situational leadership is where, okay, in the situation, I’m dealing with the person who’s not necessarily the first one to raise their hand. But let me understand who they are as a person and their experience and their background. I find that as a leader, when I am in it, like I mentioned before, in a meeting, if I see someone kind of thinking, I will stop, pause, bring them out and ask the question blankly. I see you thinking, can you share what’s going on? You can do that. You can pause the meeting and bring the different voices into the conversation. I would say getting to know that person, again, understanding their background. So when you’re in or you have maybe a project that needs to be assigned, if you always go to the person who’s always raising their hand, it’s like in school, you have a teacher’s pet, then you’re not helping to grow your teams at all. So understanding the experience backgrounds and what people want next will help you to determine how you share the different workloads and projects that come about. I’m also a firm believer that you have to take your career in your own hands. So people should be stepping up and saying, hey, leader, this is what I’m looking for, what I want, or how do I grow the skills that I need? But as a leader, you can start the conversation as well. You don’t have to wait for people to share that. But listening is another one. I’m very much a driver. So if I’m in a meeting and it’s quiet, I want to jump in. If I’m even in a one-on-one conversation, I’m going to help you get your answer out. I’ve learned sometimes you just have to listen and hear what people have to say and don’t guess. So never guess what someone’s desires and their background is. You’ve got to ask the questions. And ultimately, for all of that to work, you have to care. So as an extroverted leader, you have to care about each person on your team, what they want, what’s next for them, and then that will help you to execute and navigate your working relationship with all the folks on your team. What are ways that an extroverted leader might unintentionally shut down their quieter folks? Talking over people. I did that a lot at the very beginning. I can’t lie. I will tell you that. And I got feedback that I was doing that. I didn’t even recognize it. And I’d usually come off very confident, right? You kind of see that, right, even in the podcast. And so I would, when I walked into the room, it was, it was, let’s go, you know, and everyone would look to me. So in a room when everyone’s looking for decisions to be made or who researched this, and the person who was responsible might be one of my extroverted leaders or direct reports, everyone would look to me because I would be the first one to speak. I was the loudest one in the room. I was the, okay, with your card, definitely knows the answer. And I didn’t give my team enough faith to step forward and show their cops, show what they’ve done. And I definitely shut that down. So as an extroverted leader, learning how to sit back, delegate to your team, and allow them to shine, and then giving feedback where necessary, I’m going to go back to the question you asked before, what can extroverts do to help their introvert teams in giving them fresh feedback when it happens? I keep going back to the meeting example, because I do a lot, a lot virtually, right? A lot of my conversations are over the screen. And so if you see someone not stepping up or stepping out or not sharing, and during the meeting is not always the best time, usually it’s not to have a one-on-one feedback session. After the fact, as a leader, you should say, I knew you knew that answer. Why didn’t you step up? Or what can we do better to help you, you know, bring that forward next time? Or, you know, whether it’s presentation skills, whether it’s, you know, just being able to communicate succinctly, whatever the path gives, how do we make sure we give that feedback right away so that they can work on that gap? And then as well, and like as you mentioned, where can leaders fail? I think leaders need to ask that of their teams. I’m using the word feedback a lot. Let me give you, I want to give you an example of a great question. This is my magical feedback question. You ready, Greg? Yeah, I’m ready. The question I ask when I ask for feedback is, on a scale from one to 10, what is the quality of my performance, my project, my leadership in the last week, month quarter? However, often you’re asking for that. And I ask for one to 10 specifically because I don’t want an answer that says, oh, it’s good, or it could have been better. If you give me a seven, thank you for that. What can I do to make it a 10? Because I want to know where my gap is. I want to know how I can get better. And if it’s, well, if it’s a three or four, I’m going to ask how can I get to a five, right? I’m not going to jump all the way to 10. But if it’s a 10, why so high? What did I do? Because I want to make that repeatable. Greg, that question requires the person to respond in a specific way that I can take action on it. If you give me a broad answer of it’s going well, I can’t do better or do worse with that. But when you’re a leader and you’re giving feedback and as a leader, I’m asking my team, what can I do better to help serve you and show your brilliance to the world? And if they say, you’re kind of talking over me in the meeting, that’s actionable feedback I can do the very next meeting or the very next project that they’re working on. So you always want actionable feedback. So you have to ask specific questions when you’re trying to be better, fill that gap and be the best version of yourself at home and at work. I think it would make a lot of people uncomfortable just asking that of your reports and probably makes them a bit uncomfortable. It can. And what I always say is if you don’t have to answer now, you’d like to think about it and bring it back to me. When I share, when I ask the question, I always say, whatever you say back, I’m going to try to do better. So don’t give it to me thinking she’s just going to hate me later. No, I’m always looking better. And I usually will come with, here’s something I’m working on because that’s another way to ask the question instead of kind of direct. It could be I’m working on trying not to take over meetings. Can you help me the next time that I do that? Just kind of let me know, wipe your brow or on where you’re on camera or send me a note saying, give me whatever our secret word is, pineapples. And I’m like, yes, I need to. Your introvert safe word. Exactly. My introvert safe word. Like, oh, I think you stepped on their toe with your car. You might want to pull that back. So I try to keep that conversation conversational and let them know that I’m really my goal is to be better. And if you can’t think of something I could do better, I already know I’m working on something. So I’ll share that with them so they can easily give that feedback back. Yeah, that’s excellent. There could be some ways to temper it. I’m just working on my leadership. Is there anything you can think of that I could do better? That’s probably worth an experiment to see how people react to the scale question. Sounds like that’s some kind of the secret sauce you found there. Definitely. So if you’re Gary, I’m telling you it’s worth it. The nuggets you get out of that conversation is gold. And again, that works in your personal life as well. So if you’re at home at your spouse, your partner, your it’s complicated, whoever you with, you can ask that same question to whether it’s your kids and your parents or your co-workers. That’s very, and again, temperate how you need to, but feedback on it will help us grow. One of the things I teach is make feedback your friend. That’s exactly a chapter in my book is make feedback your friend because if you don’t, and you’re going to stand your head too long thinking and overthinking, that’s a problem I think all of us have, whether it’s introvert or extrovert, you can overthink the situation, remove all doubt and just ask the question. You had this concept of guilt-free leadership. Can you tell me a bit more about that? Yeah, we’ve actually been tap dancing around it a little bit today. So guilt-free leadership is the topic I speak on and it comes from two angles when you think about leading guilt-free. It’s number one, that authenticity piece that I’m going to show up and be me and you don’t have to love me, but you’re going to respect me, but you’re not going to come at it from an angle of a month. I truly believe that leadership you gain is based on influence, not on a title. So when you come as yourself, it’s not to take over the room, it’s not to make everyone be like you. Your goal is, I want to show up to be my whole self at work, but I want you to do the same. So there might be some give and take. I need to understand and learn you so you can show up as your full self, because we come to work. It’s hard. You have to put these blinders on and you can only act a certain way and say a certain thing. My best compliment I hear is, man, Jakar, you’re the same in the break room as well as the boardroom. So there’s all, you know, you want to be careful, right? There’s when you’re talking to higher level people, there’s conversation that you need to have and have some business acumen. But at the same time, I’m going to give you my feedback. I’m going to share the way that I share. This is my personality. So they’re definitely being authentic in the workplace. And again, understanding who you are. We talked about that already, how to show up authentically you. But the second part of the guilt-free leadership that I teach is we don’t just work. We live, right? And there’s an understanding of having to navigate work and life. How do we do both? And when I’m at work, how do I manage home? And when I’m home, how do I manage work? And it really becomes being present where you are. So if, you know, I’m a big, big proponent of family first. When I’m in my work setting and with my leaders, or my team, which I have leaders in my team, I share with them that, yes, work is important. There’s a business critical need here. But if something is going on at home and your mind is there, how do we make sure that you take care of what you need to? Who can backfill you here? And vice versa. Sometimes there’s a business critical need and you’re at home. What help can you ask for to support your home life? But you have to figure that out for you. I always tell the people like coach and mentor is you have to define success for yourself and don’t let anyone guilt you on your definition of what success is. Because no matter what you choose, it’s going to be wrong in someone’s eyes. So first, stepping up and realizing, how do I want to navigate my life? And what does that look like? What boundaries do I need to put in place? So I can’t allow people to put their perspective on that. And then from there, it becomes just leaving, living that out and removing all guilt. Like this is what I’ve decided and I’m moving forward. And you’ve got to surround yourself with people who cheerlead you and be up here in that process. So guilt free both in showing up your as yourself and putting the boundaries around in your life and navigating what that looks like for you. It’s really interesting. The two pieces about the sources of guilt, if you are not taking care of your family, then you would feel quite a bit of guilt. I think if you’re not taking care of yourself and your own needs, that’s a source of guilt. And so you can eliminate it that way. No, that’s good. I like to work here because that’s exactly what I think of guilt. The only reason we have guilt is because we care because if I didn’t care, I wouldn’t feel guilty. I can do what I want to do. I don’t care, but care about your family. So when you’re not there, you’re worried or vice versa. You care about your job and the output you put in your how you perform. And so there’s always the sense of I’m never doing, there might be a sense of I’m never doing enough, but that’s where you have to define it for yourself. In this season of my life, I work on an estimating and proposal. During those times, I say, okay, I’ve got a business critical need. I need help at home. Who can help me take the kids to their sports and their doctor’s appointments? And maybe I need to move their appointments out. And it’s not that I don’t care about you. And it’s not that I don’t care about my job, but I’m deciding for this season, this week, this month, this is how my life is going to look. And then there are times where, hey, my son, he’s in the championship, can someone take over this meeting? And so I’m finding ways to be sure that my team is supported while I’m giving my attention at home. And I’m not choosing either one. I’m choosing both because I want both of them to be supported. It takes time. It takes people. It takes, like I said, support to make that happen. But if it’s my choice, then I’m showing that I care about it all. And I’m not going to let anyone feel guilty about the decisions I’ve made. And that’s the hard part. Like I said, you’re always going to care. You only feel guilty because you care. But you’ve got to make some decisions. And that boundary is going to help you release the guilt from what you’ve defined as success for your life and that whatever season you’re in. It’s not easy. And it does not always go away. But that is the attempt that we’re making is let me make the decision so I can let the guilt fall. It seems really helpful to be intentional about that. And taking care of your family, all your needs. But the other part, I mean, people might, you know, try to make you feel guilty because they have different standards. But you might also be attached to some standards that are not authentically your own. So, you know, I think that’s, yeah, yeah. I’m good. I’m sorry. I was just like, I wanted to clap. I’m like, what? That’s good. We do. We take on other people like standards. Someone said, you know, a mother looks like this. And when you don’t act like this, and you’re not a good mom, and then I’m, am I going to feel terrible if I’m not doing the 12 things that maybe your mother did or someone else or you’re a businessman and you have, you know, you’re an entrepreneur and someone says you’re supposed to be doing 12 meetings a month and calling and you’re not doing who, what is it that you need to do? And that’s why I said that I love that we’re intentional. Be intentional about what that looks like for you and everyone else. You can do whatever you need to do. I’m going to say something else, but you know what I’m saying, let them go. Work your life. This is, oh my, my, uh, one year. Oh, it was really rough. And she, when you could spray, she said, um, what did she say? You mind your business, let them run their mouth and you mind your business. So they can say what they want to say. You do what you need to. Ah, such good stuff. So when, when you’re talking to, you know, you’re seeing your leaders and you see them developing and they’re, they’re becoming a leader or coming into their own. What are some of the signs that you see? That’s excellent. Yes. One of the myths that we see a lot is if you’re good in your technical roles and you’re ready for leadership and leading people is very different than leading data because data is on a page. It’s on a paper. When you’re leading people, you really have to understand, like I said, that human behavior side. So understanding who you are, right? How you lead, what are your superpowers? But when I start seeing people looking at the team and honestly learning how to collaborate better with each other, those are the soft skills that you need to have as a leader. Those are things that some companies don’t teach. We teach you how to do the technical stuff and then throw you in a leadership role and hope you get there. But being a leader that shows, again, that human behavior side, how do I understand other people? Do I communicate well? So when I start seeing people building on those soft skills, then you kind of start tapping into and, and help giving them additional training and feedback and advice on how to better lead others. Again, the definition of leadership does not come with a title, right? Leadership for me is influence. We have, we call L codes because that’s L code as a leader in our company, but you don’t have to be a capital L to be a leader. You can be a lowercase L and show up as a leader, no matter what your social style is, no matter what your Myers-Briggs says, how do you show up in your teams? And then if you don’t have the opportunity, because maybe you’re working a role that’s very, very technical, very specific, ask for that stretch assignment, ask for an opportunity to lead a team or a project where you can exert those types of skill sets so that you can practice that and be ready possibly for that next step. I think people who are listening are probably, you know, have some of self-awareness and if there’s just no self-awareness, they’re probably not going to get very far. But, you know, once you develop that, then, then it’s time to seek out help and seek out feedback and try some of these things. Practice it, gotta put it into use. Yeah. And so I think we touched on this a little bit. So much of the workplace is taking place over virtual meetings, which can be, you know, in some ways, a plus for quieter people. You’re not in a room surrounded by people. There’s a certain level that you can manage it, but it could also be tricky to break in and be heard. And you mentioned dropping a note in the chat. I know some of the software has the hand raise button now, which I really, it wasn’t right at first, but they got it right because now it queues up. And you’re like, it keeps the order of the people who have raised their hand. And you can see people slowly adopt it, like even just the people whose natural tendency to dominate the meeting is, and they still jump in sometimes, but you see that this pure pressure builds. It’s kind of interesting. So what are some other things about virtual meetings that you can share advice on? Yes. So when you’re in a in-person meeting, you have the opportunity to not just speak, but your body language speaks as well. I think what you say is only 10%, right? 30% of how you say it, and or 20% of how you say it, and then 70% of what your body does. Now, my face is very expressive. So I speak a lot with my mouth closed. And that is actually one thing I’ve been working on my entire life. And I think I’m better, I hope. But when you’re in a virtual meeting, you’ll find that there’s a lot of people won’t turn their cameras on. And it’s not, so some companies or some meetings, it may not be required. So like I said, it’s kind of safe. I can just sit back and listen and I might even be multitasking. But with the camera on, that’s my biggest advice, especially if you’re in a meeting where there are people a couple of levels above you, they may not ever see you again. That is your time. That’s, you know, when we were in the office, we would say, you know, you got to rub shoulders with, you know, the vice president or, you know, your director, but it might even be someone that’s your boss’s boss’s boss. They may, you know, it depends on how big your company is, that might be your opportunity. Again, that’s how you show up. If you’re in person or you’re in a meeting, you would sit there, you pay attention and you want them to know that you’re, and even if you never speak, if you show up on camera, you’re showing how present you are in the conversation. Again, whether you speak or not, you’re showing that you’re present and you want to have that conversation out loud or with your, with your body language, right? I think a lot of people take that for granted and I get it if you don’t have to. I have a really early morning meeting and my team is like, you do not want to see this face at 7am. So there’s definitely some meetings where it might be okay, but I would say start leaning towards showing up and showing your presence and not just being a face or a box on the screen. Again, if you have something to share, drop that in the chat, raise your hands. One of my teammates, she’s more introverted and she’s like, I can never get enough time to summarize what I think. So we talked about what if you were the notetaker for the meeting and some of our meetings now are AI, we have some rise of the meeting for you, but she’ll be the notetaker or she’ll take the actions and she’ll send it out to the meeting and say, hey, we just got out of the meeting, here are the high points. So what that helps with is that shows that you’re present, your name shows up in everyone’s inbox. So now, again, you didn’t say anything, but now your name is out there and so, okay, oh, that’s Lisa. Lisa, you know, she’s the one that updates us on all the things that’s happening on the program and your name gets associated with the content. So depending on the meeting, that might be another way to show up without actually, you know, speaking in the meeting, but and you’re showing that you’re providing content. Take those stretch assignments is another opportunity in a meeting is, hey, I’ll take that action and I’ll follow what with the team. Again, that allows you to work with the people outside of the meeting. If you’re not saying or sharing something during that time, but you’re showing again, your positive business impact. I think that’s really important to do, again, if you’re in a virtual setting and you’re not able to show up, you can show up outside the meeting to show your support for what’s happening in the room, that makes sense. Yeah, we’re talking about visibility here. And these are really great practical tips to raise your visibility, even if you’re not really jumping in, maybe you’re not at a point with this level or this group where that’s comfortable or natural yet, but then through your written communications, you’re setting the stage and making it more likely people will call on you and you would get those opportunities. Exactly. And share your expertise in those conversations outside the meeting, whether it’s email or you’ll be able to show your brilliance. That’s why I hired you. You’ve had brilliance. So definitely, you summarize that greatly. Yeah, be present. Yeah, I like that. That’s important to how often do you see people visibly multitasking, you know, completely guilty of this myself, but just being conscious of the impact you want to have on other people. So all excellent advice. The last thing I wanted to touch on was your leadership as a parent. So what are some things you’ve learned about? And then you have a wide range of kids. So what are some of the things you’ve learned about leading as a parent? Yeah, leading as a parent has been interesting. My youngest currently at the time of this recording is 14. My oldest is 27. And he has three kids of his own. So it’s a wide range. And I have four kids. I’ve learned that every one of them is different. They have individual personalities. The way that I interact with them is different. Think I mentioned earlier, I could raise my voice at my oldest and he’d be like, whatever you say, mom, and then my oldest daughter completely ignores me like I never lived here. Like I was never alive. Like, wait a minute, what’s happening? So back to that situational leadership. I love the books that are out today. And I’m a big reader, a big fan of personal development. So when I first started my career journey, I did a lot of reading and understanding about how to lead others. And I took that knowledge and applied it at home. I’m like, hmm, I wonder this whole situational leadership, I keep talking about how I have to deal with people differently. How does that look like at home? So it did exactly that. My oldest son very good at school. He can close his eyes through the whole class and get an A on the test. And great. We will praise him for that. You did a great job. But then my daughter, she would study hard, take forever, try to understand it and get a C. And it would be like, that’s all you got. I learned if that I want you to do your best. So I’m going to praise you for the hard work you put in to get the output that you did. And is there something different or more or whatever we can do? If not, keep doing what you’re doing. My son, maybe I need to challenge you a little bit more. Maybe there’s something else that you’re more interested in and not just crazy because it was easy, but how do I challenge you? So understanding who they are as individuals helps me be a better parent in that now I have to navigate who I am as an individual. Because now I may have to step up my game. These are things that I don’t know or don’t understand. But with my younger two, definitely newer generation, they’re living in a world that I have never lived in. With social media, with the internet access, with all the things at their fingertips, they can just speak to the phone and get any answer they want. I remember growing up, I wanted to know something. My mom would say, go look at my encyclopedia. And I would be, I don’t want to know it that bad. Because I didn’t want to have to go to the encyclopedia and open it up and, you know, learn about Turkey or whatever, you know, the country of Turkey and Jordan, because I don’t know why I was interested in that at the time. And I’m like, don’t care that much. Now, my daughter, I mean, any and every nothingness that she will ask about. So now I don’t have to teach her anything, but that has me thinking, well, what else can, what other support does she need? Right? It’s not knowledge, but I still want her to grow up to be a great citizen. You know, I want her to be wise and ethical. I want her to have great character. So there’s other ways that I’m parenting her that I didn’t do with my older to just because of the world that we’re living in. And I find that I fall short because kids, they typically would give you feedback, whether you ask it or not. And it’s in those moments, okay, I can do better. Or no, y’all need to do better. It’s not me. This is the you thing. And we don’t have to work this out. But being a parent and leading in that way, again, it’s almost like it’s the same thing that is in the workplace. I need to figure out what my superpowers are, what it means to be authentically me. But then where do I need to shift and change so that I can navigate who they are and give them space that psychological safety so they can be themselves as they’re growing and learning about themselves. And I give them that space so that we can grow together. That’s fantastic. And there’s such a synergy there between the parenting at home. I love that part about the feedback, like, like, it’s so true. I became a better leader at work after being a parent. What’s the feedback and the feedback of experience that you get with with your kids? Oh, yeah, you hit the nail on the head with that. I love that I became a better leader at work because of being a parent. It’s you. That’s so true. 100%. Jaqara, this has been so much fun and really, really great advice. If people want to learn more about you and your work, where can they go? Follow me on LinkedIn. I’m just Jaqara Rivera. You can find me on LinkedIn. You’re giving some leadership tips and advice. My book, The Leadership Trifecta, is on theleadershiptrifecta.com. And it’s really about leading yourself, your work, and your home. Not everyone has kids. Not everyone is working a corporate job. Maybe they’re in entrepreneurship or they’re in time in their life where they’re just volunteering. So how do we navigate all three of those and lead in an authentic way, taking 100% responsibility for your life, defining it the way that you want it, and also that self is so important as well. You have to lead yourself in a way that’s healthy for you so that you can lead a long, successful life. So those are the two ways that, you know, follow me on LinkedIn, get the book, The Leadership Trifecta, and you’re going to, again, level up your life, up level your thinking to become the best version of you. Amen. Thanks so much for being on the show today. Awesome. Thank you for having me and add me back because I love these conversations. All right. We’ll do. Okay, let’s take a moment to recap here. Number one, authentic leadership starts with self-knowledge. It may sound scary, but it’s absolutely worth it to find out what people are saying about you when you leave the room. What are the top three words that they use to talk about you? The gap between how you show up and the way you want to be seen is the space where you can take control of your personal brand. You don’t have to turn into someone else. You just need to be really clear about the way you want to be remembered. Number two, feedback is your fastest lever for growth. And Jakara gave us a really powerful question to use here. On a scale of one to 10, how is my leadership this week? And then what would it take to make that a 10? That’s it. It’s really powerful. You’re taking away all the wiggle room that people have to get away from telling you their honest thoughts, and it’s really the truth that you need to improve. And number three, guilt-free leadership isn’t about getting it all done perfectly. It’s about being intentional. Define what success means for you, both at work and at home, and then set the boundaries that make it all possible. Then let that guilt go. Just make sure it’s your own standards that you’re trying to match. I really enjoyed this episode. Jakara made me laugh pretty hard, which is a great way to help the straight talk go down. And that’s a hallmark of leadership that I really aspire to. If this episode resonated with you, the best thing you can do now is to subscribe. I’d really appreciate it wherever you listen to podcasts. I’m Greg Weinger. Keep leading with quiet confidence, and I’ll see you next time.